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Iraq Armchair War Diaries

John Dentino wrote:

I think Jeff and I are talking about the way the
Sixties ended up—Altamont, Manson,

the way the flower children grew up
into Yuppies who were the worst examples of materialism

agreed on this point

—worse than the
button-down Christian Right even—at least those religious people could
keep perspective about their spiritual lives—

in the sense that the spiritual exist, i would agree

We are saying that the
Death of the Father (as embodied in Kennedy’s gory public assasination)
twisted our idealism into something narcissistic

aggreed here also



and We—through the
process of gorging on the intricate patterns in our own navels—We, yes
We the anointed generation—turned the culture into a frightening
Bacchanal more than a benign Agape love fest.

So if i understand you too correctly your problem with the 60’s is not with
it’s ethical idealism, it is it degeneration into material hedonism
I have no idea where that guy is. He is all over the road. I was also
              a Dionysian mess—-all my sympathies go to the poor king who deplored
              the madness and excesses, and, sadly for him, believed he could control
              the irrational. Suspect G has paternal “issues” which cloud his judgment.
              The hero fights the dark forces—-and usually loses. I’d rather go down
              fighting than give in to irrationality—-the preferred mode of the day. I’ll never
              succeed but not to try isn’t human.
       


On Aug 1, 2004, at 10:07 PM, John Dentino wrote:

I forgot to include the one line that prompted Kraig’s last incoherent message. Of course, I’m referring to my own subjective, past personal state of alcohol and pot-induced Hell here:

Begin forwarded message:

From: John Dentino
I didn’t say you don’t know what the play is about. I ‘m not Pentheus. If anything, I worship Dionysus more than you do.

Kraig Grady wrote:

So if i understand you too correctly your problem with the 60’s is not with
it’s ethical idealism, it is it degeneration into material hedonism

John Dentino:

Yes, sir.

i do not see the islamic church as any more pro military than the
Christian, but both have fallen into this trap , the first through it
absorption into the roman empire, forever tainting it. Possibly if the
romans would never have taken it up, it would not be so.
the islamic religions greatest thinkers are a great distance from those
of Al Queda. the influence of Avicenna and Averorres is great upon the
most basic jewish philosophy to this day. In fact jews only abandoned
writing in arabic when confronted by the Christians in spain, then they
turned away from latin to hebrew. up till the 9th century, it is in
arabic or persian.
Alquada has fallen from the likes of ibn arabi and the likes as well as
the two above.

John Dentino wrote:

of course we can see that Al queda has fallen into the same
psychological state.

“fallen into”? Interesting choice of words, my man. Does that mean you
think Al Qaida had a higher calling at one time? How could they have
fallen? What does that mean?
On Aug 2, 2004, at 5:21 PM, Kraig Grady wrote:

i am sure ron could edited this all down into seven lines and will
guarantee i will never get a job at the weekly. If i am jacking off it is
because the damn republicans have done in my job for the most part. at
least i should be grateful that i am not blacklisted like johanna by them.
yet!

you can yell christian all you want but nature has no examples of the
puritan (yet myriad s of the whore). here you had men with long hair,
intoxicating substances, the tambourine, and violence against all those who
weren’t of their kind. ( unlike the punkettes who would sneak out without a
peep if the cops showed up to close done the shows, {wimps}. What could be
more dionysian.
God and goddesses are patterns of behavior beyond the power of any chistist
senex secret society. My rant of bachae began as via it obvious manifestation during the 60’s
down to the damn tambourine, that you might remember was outlawed from
being played in cars. ( having no cassette players the hippies would travel
down sunset or past fairfax ( that high school being one of the hubs of the
movement here)  and play their tambourines in the car. no one told them
about this, it just happened like magic

but being in the haight as a runaway in 66-67, it was well known and
thought by many there it was already over and the real brains (beatniks)
had left.
and it is good to be reminded as such, but they had no idea what god was
going to pop up.

any of yours take on the punks , i would be more than entertain, i draw a
blank on them


  RS-Quite enjoyed your clarinet playing the other night rehashing old
pieces. do you still play?

    But i have already ranting to john about religion, how it is time for
some new (just reasonable ones really, not new for new sake). Sacrifice
came from the notion that the earth was flat and the sun died each night
and had to be reborn. Christist religion is nothing but an updated version
of Osiris and Isis and they even had horus who avenges his fathers death as
the antichrist. They left out his four sons though)Throw in the bachae,
being rewritten by the homosexual secret societies stemming from plato
(popper takes care of him BTW) and gaining control of the early church and
you have a mess that is a little too unimaginative to last beyond where it
did.
it is blind to its own miracles. point in fact. Mary was pregnant only 17
days, just look at when the annunciation is. 17 is one if not the most
common number in the bible. That this is the number of squares that make up
the swastika , is i am sure just a coincidence.

The horizon set by that truly divine inspiration has been left a full ocean
and continent behind.  We can’t go back to the head of a pin.

The reality is in this society people will accept the least bit of pseudo
science as portrayed in the newspapers (which often is absurd beyond
belief, with it being contradicted by some other form of research, but no
one seems to notice) and christist ideas have no value to the masses
outside the golden rule. be a good boy and everything will be OK. The truth
is only in rare moments of inspiration none of us at our age have the
stamina to do anything but!!!

  Ethics is not religion, the former is better done by philosophy which
is really where it has been done all along anyway.

That leaves cosmology which i expect that no amount of money pumping up
the big bang ( here is a great example of religion having to use the truth
of science to validate itself, science sure doesn’t have to do the
opposite) os going to hold water for much longer.


John Dentino wrote:

I was responding in Greek mythological terms because Grady started up
with his Bacchae talk. I don’t really favor greco-roman gods for
anything other than elucidating human psychology. For me, Christianity
illuminates the the relationship between our ethical lives our maker
(singular) much better. You know, Grady’s a pagan. Sumbitch. He’s
one-of-a-kind, though. gotta love ‘im.

On Aug 2, 2004, at 3:13 PM, Ronald Stringer wrote:

Surely you’ve heard the expression “Shop till you drop”! As to Dead
Fathers and such, maybe when you guys are through jerking each other
off you’d like to take me for a spin. I mean, whence this desperation
to identify with this or that zeitgeist?

Oh, Ronny baby…are you free of all cultural trappings? Other than
Whittaker Chambers, whose your Dead Daddy? Come on, give us younger
guys a break. We were in sixth grade when Kennedy had his head blown
off. You were a cynical high school senior, no doubt.

Posted at 5am on 10/24/2004 | comments are closed Filed Under: Under the Lens

"The sleep of reason
brings forth monsters."






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